I have set up a new blogspot site that all members of the neighborhood can use for the purpose of bettering the community, rather than this one.
the address is http://costellocommunity.blogspot.com
Anyone can post a comment and if you want to be an author on the blog, just leave your email address and I can add you to the list of authors. There can be up to 100 authors, so anyone can join in.
I am disabling the comments on this blog now as I feel it has outlived its purpose, and the whole thing has become a guessing game. Prying into personal lives is what created the whole mess in the first place, and I won't be a part of it any more. I made my point and allowed others to do the same and that was my goal in the first place.
Feel free to comment on the new blog as much as you like.
Coach14
Thursday, April 9, 2009
Wednesday, April 8, 2009
Moving On...
Finally some good ideas.
A BBQ would be an excellent way to start the healing process in the community. (thanks Anne for the original idea!)
Any suggestions on any of the following would be appreciated:
Date & Time?
Location?
Do we want to do it as a charity event where we sell the food & drinks at a slight markup & donate the profit to a worthwhile cause?
Otherwise who pays for it or do we BYOBBQ?
Volunteers to donate the BBQ's & to do the "cheffing"?
Any other ideas are more than welcome as well. Now that everyone has had a chance to say their piece, lets use this blog for good reasons.
A BBQ would be an excellent way to start the healing process in the community. (thanks Anne for the original idea!)
Any suggestions on any of the following would be appreciated:
Date & Time?
Location?
Do we want to do it as a charity event where we sell the food & drinks at a slight markup & donate the profit to a worthwhile cause?
Otherwise who pays for it or do we BYOBBQ?
Volunteers to donate the BBQ's & to do the "cheffing"?
Any other ideas are more than welcome as well. Now that everyone has had a chance to say their piece, lets use this blog for good reasons.
Tuesday, April 7, 2009
Monday, April 6, 2009
The Last Post
This will be my last official post on the issue.
This is because I am tired of banging my head against a brick wall.
It is impossible to have a civil, reasoned debate with a person who:
- Preaches democracy yet exhibits a communist state approch to her blog and her editorial views. It reminds me of a state sanctioned newspaper used for propaganda purposes.
- Tries to pass off opinion as fact, but has provided absolutely no evidence or proof to substantiate her major "facts". Show us the evidence to convince us, Saxon, not just your slanted version of how things are and how they should be.
- Refuses to admit errors, despite the ironclad, overwhelming nature of the evidence against her statement or fact. Her response is always: someone else's fault, a mis-remembering, a difference in recollection or "I can't explain it, that's just how it was." Either that or something along the lines of "yes I made a mistake but it doesn't change anything" (see her post "whats a few cents between neighbors"
- Relies on hearsay, conjecture and assumptions to make arguements, and then is too pig-headed or blind to even alter her stance when the truth is staring her in the face.
- Realizes nobody cares about her original complaint about garbage, so rounds up anyone in the community with a beef against Larry to join her to change the issue from that of garbage to one of leadership.
- Exhibits a holier-than-thou attitude about the board and then makes a statement that is a bold-faced lie. This one hasn't been publicized but will come out sooner or later. This one is not retractable, not explainable, and not justifiable.
- Apparently lives by the credo "Do as I say, not as I do" as she has been unwilling to set the example and pick up the trash that is left on her garbage pad, now 4 days after pickup.
- Complains about the Board having the nerve to tell people what to do, despite the apparent mandate supporting them, yet she had the nerve to go about "telling them they needed to offer the job to all the owners." among others
- Posts a blog alienating all board members, and property manager, by calling them names, referring to me as egocentric, hysterical and "foaming at the mouth" and falsely accusing people of threatening her, yet she is shocked and/or appalled when someone returns in kind with shameless and vindictive.
- Achieves her alleged "goal" yet continues on the vendetta.
In closing, I leave Saxon Harding with some advice:
If you want to convince people, you need to supply facts to back up your suppositions and opinions. Acknowledge mistakes you make, and correct them.
Burying your head in the sand and pretending the facts don't exist makes you look foolish, and also makes you look like a bully. Who is the real "Intimidator"?
Assumptions are dangerous, and you have made a LOT that are not even close to reality. They will come back to bite you at some point before all is said and done.
I will keep the blog site open for others to comment and will create new topics when topics are needed to avoid long "comments" sections.
Feel free to use it or not.
In the end the truth will come out. Sooner than you think.
This is because I am tired of banging my head against a brick wall.
It is impossible to have a civil, reasoned debate with a person who:
- Preaches democracy yet exhibits a communist state approch to her blog and her editorial views. It reminds me of a state sanctioned newspaper used for propaganda purposes.
- Tries to pass off opinion as fact, but has provided absolutely no evidence or proof to substantiate her major "facts". Show us the evidence to convince us, Saxon, not just your slanted version of how things are and how they should be.
- Refuses to admit errors, despite the ironclad, overwhelming nature of the evidence against her statement or fact. Her response is always: someone else's fault, a mis-remembering, a difference in recollection or "I can't explain it, that's just how it was." Either that or something along the lines of "yes I made a mistake but it doesn't change anything" (see her post "whats a few cents between neighbors"
- Relies on hearsay, conjecture and assumptions to make arguements, and then is too pig-headed or blind to even alter her stance when the truth is staring her in the face.
- Realizes nobody cares about her original complaint about garbage, so rounds up anyone in the community with a beef against Larry to join her to change the issue from that of garbage to one of leadership.
- Exhibits a holier-than-thou attitude about the board and then makes a statement that is a bold-faced lie. This one hasn't been publicized but will come out sooner or later. This one is not retractable, not explainable, and not justifiable.
- Apparently lives by the credo "Do as I say, not as I do" as she has been unwilling to set the example and pick up the trash that is left on her garbage pad, now 4 days after pickup.
- Complains about the Board having the nerve to tell people what to do, despite the apparent mandate supporting them, yet she had the nerve to go about "telling them they needed to offer the job to all the owners." among others
- Posts a blog alienating all board members, and property manager, by calling them names, referring to me as egocentric, hysterical and "foaming at the mouth" and falsely accusing people of threatening her, yet she is shocked and/or appalled when someone returns in kind with shameless and vindictive.
- Achieves her alleged "goal" yet continues on the vendetta.
In closing, I leave Saxon Harding with some advice:
If you want to convince people, you need to supply facts to back up your suppositions and opinions. Acknowledge mistakes you make, and correct them.
Burying your head in the sand and pretending the facts don't exist makes you look foolish, and also makes you look like a bully. Who is the real "Intimidator"?
Assumptions are dangerous, and you have made a LOT that are not even close to reality. They will come back to bite you at some point before all is said and done.
I will keep the blog site open for others to comment and will create new topics when topics are needed to avoid long "comments" sections.
Feel free to use it or not.
In the end the truth will come out. Sooner than you think.
Sunday, April 5, 2009
So as not to confuse anyone (Saxon Harding) with more than one fact at a time
The garbage fees never doubled. Stop saying they did.
Saxon, in case you haven't figured it out....
You already won. In case you missed it, Larry has quit, and he isn't coming back. (Excuse me for altering it slightly Larry, as I wanted to highlight the one sentence.)
His post was:
Larry Tidman said...
TO READERS OF Coach14's BLOG, THIS WILL BE A LONG COMMENT. IT WILL BE MY ONLY COMMENT AS I NO LONGER WANT TO ADDRESS THE SAME QUESTIONS AND CONCERNS OVER & OVER AS I HAVE FOR THE PAST THREE YEARS.
TO Saxon Harding
Please pay attention as I am going to address your concerns for the last time. I know that I am likely wasting my time with you, but I have a lot of time on my one hand while I am recovering from my surgery.
There was never any contract and I never said there was. That was made quite clear to Karen Taylor at Dixon Management, when she asked about "outstanding contracts or arrangements" for services when Dixon Management took over the property management of Costello Gardens.She was told about the landscaping, snow removal and the arrangement that I had for the garbage service and how it had started.
What you keep referring to as a contract is an 'arrangement' that was made between the Owners Committee and Moose Contracting to provide garbage services to Costello Gardens, When Moose Contracting bailed, the other board member that you continue to mention and myself (after speaking to Stan Caniff of the Regional Group about "any problems if we do this") took over the 'arrangement', which I continued until this year. If Karen Taylor told you that there was a contract, then you better talk to her which I am sure you will, but I never said there was a contract! I am being to think that you substituted the word arrangement for the word contract.
Yes Saxon Harding, I am a subcontractor, I do a lot of subcontract work for general contractors, so what. I think that you tried to imply that I was a subcontractor of Dixon Management, to further your "conflict of interest" agenda. Just to prove how uninformed you are, I can also be a contractor, if I am the one who is contracted directly to perform the work. I can then give some of the work within the contact to another contractor, who becomes a subcontractor. As most of the work that I do is for contractors who hire me to perform certain types of work. I am generally a subcontractor.
As for the list of your questions regarding me and my company, nature of my work etc, as I have told you and more than once, it is none of your business! As for your interpetation of numbers and amounts paid and not paid..... look at Coach14's post, "Simple mathematics & Rate increases", there is a comment posted by a reader that explains everything quite clearly and in an easy to understand manner. Hopefully even you could understand it if you took time to read it. It is all from the Audited Financial Statement for year end, January 31st, 2007 thay was issued to all of us from Marcil Lavalee, Chartered Accountants. Who is right you or the Chartered Accountants ? My company, my business and my status are none of your business. As you have been told and more than once, "It's on a need to know basis and you don't need to know" I am tempted to use stronger wording but, in this case I will let common sense prevail.
As far as my company doing work for the board, the only questions that would be relevant would be as to "whether the work was being done in a proper manner consistent with the requirements of the job and in a timely effective manner". From the mess that I saw after the 6th of March, 2009, it looks like the questions above were answered. Although I should point out that there seems to be some owners who took it upon themselves to get out and clean up the mess on our pad. Their actions speak louder than your words. Time to take pictures, no time to help clean up! It is myself who is on the board and my company who was doing the work for the board.
You have no need or any special status to ask any questions about my company, my status with the company or otherwise. Again it is none of your business! I am not hiding anything, the Chartered Accountants, Marcil Lavallee and Nelligan O'Brien Payne the lawyers that looked into your claims of "conflict of interest" in 2007 were more than satisfied with levels of disclosure with regards to a company owned by a board member performing work for the Association. I have been up front and look what did happen.
To address your comments as to what we need or don't need for garbage service, I thought that there was a Garbage Committee "struck " at the AGM to do whatever they needed to do, investigate what owners wanted, ways to save money, how to improve the service etc...But nothing has been done by this committee to this point in time. I was of the understanding that this is what you wanted and lobbied for along with owners opinions being heard. I am still waiting along with the other owners for all this research, so we can put this garbage issue to a vote and move on. Rest assured Saxon Harding, that any new garbage service, abbreviated or however defined will not include my involvement in any way shape or form. I ceased proving my services on March 6th, 2009 I am proud of what I did for 8 plus years cleaning up Costello Gardens and most residents that live here know that what I actually did regarding garbage and cleanup outweighed what I was paid.
I gave health reasons for ceasing my garbage services, I lied!, the reason was you, I finally got to the point that I was tired of picking up other people's shit and sick and tired of having having you shit, slander, defame and otherwise on me for doing it. My health was a minor factor.
In closing, good luck with your garbage project. As far as I am concerned, I believe that your personal vendetta and your actions need to be accounted for. To act like you have and say what you have said about me and others is extremely rude and beligerant to say the least!!!
Back to me (coach14):
So Saxon, you got your way, and there is no garbage service. And you proceeded to alienate a whole lot of people in the process. So I would suggest your plan of action should be the following:
1. Post a final blog apologizing to Larry, the Board for the pain in the butt you have been and to me for falsely accusing me of threatening you based on nothing but an assumption.
2. Log off
3. Venture outside your house and pick up the garbage in the street by your garbage pad. Its your job now.
Any other posting you do on the issue shows your true colors, and that it was NEVER about the garbage.
His post was:
Larry Tidman said...
TO READERS OF Coach14's BLOG, THIS WILL BE A LONG COMMENT. IT WILL BE MY ONLY COMMENT AS I NO LONGER WANT TO ADDRESS THE SAME QUESTIONS AND CONCERNS OVER & OVER AS I HAVE FOR THE PAST THREE YEARS.
TO Saxon Harding
Please pay attention as I am going to address your concerns for the last time. I know that I am likely wasting my time with you, but I have a lot of time on my one hand while I am recovering from my surgery.
There was never any contract and I never said there was. That was made quite clear to Karen Taylor at Dixon Management, when she asked about "outstanding contracts or arrangements" for services when Dixon Management took over the property management of Costello Gardens.She was told about the landscaping, snow removal and the arrangement that I had for the garbage service and how it had started.
What you keep referring to as a contract is an 'arrangement' that was made between the Owners Committee and Moose Contracting to provide garbage services to Costello Gardens, When Moose Contracting bailed, the other board member that you continue to mention and myself (after speaking to Stan Caniff of the Regional Group about "any problems if we do this") took over the 'arrangement', which I continued until this year. If Karen Taylor told you that there was a contract, then you better talk to her which I am sure you will, but I never said there was a contract! I am being to think that you substituted the word arrangement for the word contract.
Yes Saxon Harding, I am a subcontractor, I do a lot of subcontract work for general contractors, so what. I think that you tried to imply that I was a subcontractor of Dixon Management, to further your "conflict of interest" agenda. Just to prove how uninformed you are, I can also be a contractor, if I am the one who is contracted directly to perform the work. I can then give some of the work within the contact to another contractor, who becomes a subcontractor. As most of the work that I do is for contractors who hire me to perform certain types of work. I am generally a subcontractor.
As for the list of your questions regarding me and my company, nature of my work etc, as I have told you and more than once, it is none of your business! As for your interpetation of numbers and amounts paid and not paid..... look at Coach14's post, "Simple mathematics & Rate increases", there is a comment posted by a reader that explains everything quite clearly and in an easy to understand manner. Hopefully even you could understand it if you took time to read it. It is all from the Audited Financial Statement for year end, January 31st, 2007 thay was issued to all of us from Marcil Lavalee, Chartered Accountants. Who is right you or the Chartered Accountants ? My company, my business and my status are none of your business. As you have been told and more than once, "It's on a need to know basis and you don't need to know" I am tempted to use stronger wording but, in this case I will let common sense prevail.
As far as my company doing work for the board, the only questions that would be relevant would be as to "whether the work was being done in a proper manner consistent with the requirements of the job and in a timely effective manner". From the mess that I saw after the 6th of March, 2009, it looks like the questions above were answered. Although I should point out that there seems to be some owners who took it upon themselves to get out and clean up the mess on our pad. Their actions speak louder than your words. Time to take pictures, no time to help clean up! It is myself who is on the board and my company who was doing the work for the board.
You have no need or any special status to ask any questions about my company, my status with the company or otherwise. Again it is none of your business! I am not hiding anything, the Chartered Accountants, Marcil Lavallee and Nelligan O'Brien Payne the lawyers that looked into your claims of "conflict of interest" in 2007 were more than satisfied with levels of disclosure with regards to a company owned by a board member performing work for the Association. I have been up front and look what did happen.
To address your comments as to what we need or don't need for garbage service, I thought that there was a Garbage Committee "struck " at the AGM to do whatever they needed to do, investigate what owners wanted, ways to save money, how to improve the service etc...But nothing has been done by this committee to this point in time. I was of the understanding that this is what you wanted and lobbied for along with owners opinions being heard. I am still waiting along with the other owners for all this research, so we can put this garbage issue to a vote and move on. Rest assured Saxon Harding, that any new garbage service, abbreviated or however defined will not include my involvement in any way shape or form. I ceased proving my services on March 6th, 2009 I am proud of what I did for 8 plus years cleaning up Costello Gardens and most residents that live here know that what I actually did regarding garbage and cleanup outweighed what I was paid.
I gave health reasons for ceasing my garbage services, I lied!, the reason was you, I finally got to the point that I was tired of picking up other people's shit and sick and tired of having having you shit, slander, defame and otherwise on me for doing it. My health was a minor factor.
In closing, good luck with your garbage project. As far as I am concerned, I believe that your personal vendetta and your actions need to be accounted for. To act like you have and say what you have said about me and others is extremely rude and beligerant to say the least!!!
Back to me (coach14):
So Saxon, you got your way, and there is no garbage service. And you proceeded to alienate a whole lot of people in the process. So I would suggest your plan of action should be the following:
1. Post a final blog apologizing to Larry, the Board for the pain in the butt you have been and to me for falsely accusing me of threatening you based on nothing but an assumption.
2. Log off
3. Venture outside your house and pick up the garbage in the street by your garbage pad. Its your job now.
Any other posting you do on the issue shows your true colors, and that it was NEVER about the garbage.
Saturday, April 4, 2009
Another response after further review
Once again referring to her "Secret Agent Man" blog posting & other previous postings:
Contrary to your accusations, I do not diminish your right to ask questions. I never have. As I said from the very beginning, I believe you should be able to voice your opinion. My objection is that you continually ignore the FACTS that are presented to you, and when you don't get the answer you want, you create issues where there should be no issues. On one hand you state your wishes for a democratic resolution, but on the other hand you censor opposing points of view.
NEVER, EVER have the garbage fees doubled. Your response to the fact that $40 per week X 52 weeks does not equal $1,800, was "In fact, before the flat rate was abandoned, the yearly total was $1800 a year. I know that doesn't seem right but those are the facts. I am not sure why 52 weeks were not paid but they weren't."
I can explain it. It was paid every week. Your statement was the first time, to my recollection, since this issue started that a "flat rate" was EVER mentioned as a method of payment for garbage services. Where did that come from? Can you provide a document that reports an actual figure of $1,800? Show me that, and I will shut my mouth right now, and publicly apologize to you.
The $1,800 was a phantom, fictional budgeted estimate by a new property manager. It was never an actual number. It might as well have come from "Costalotto". Same with the $3,500 figure. (My apologies to other readers for bringing this up over and over, but eventually she has to realize it, doesn't she?) If you can't garner that from looking at a simple income statement, I wouldn't want you anywhere near any business I was involved with.
You changed it from a garbage problem when you brought in a myriad of other, non-garbage related, JUA issues in an effort to discredit everyone who didn't share your viewpoint, from Larry, the rest of the Board, the Property Manager, Lawyers and now myself.
All I have ever done is point out factual errors in your arguments (which you continually ignore, despite the ironclad nature of them), or offer my own opinion on your suggestions. YOU started the personal attacks, accusations and assumptions. An opinion that differed from yours became "hysterically foaming at the mouth about some point or furiously attacking me".
You have labelled yourself as "person who is pointing out the unwholesome truth."
If it was really the truth you were after, you would have no problem admitting when you are wrong. You would also have no problem listening to other viewpoints even if they differ from your own. Your closed-minded tunnel vision proves otherwise.
Well, ma'am, I have pointed out on numerous occasions elements of your reasonings that you have stated as FACT have been absolutely wrong, most notably your strongest argument. Then you blame others for your mistakes, and proceed to lash out on yet another tangent. I haven't even discussed your bringing the issue to the media yet, in a further effort to discredit Larry Tidman.
Saxon, it really is time to cut your losses, let the garbage committee do their work (if there is still a garbage committee) and wait for your precious vote to take place to gauge the real support for your ideas.
If your idea is accepted, then you can strut around the neighborhood and take credit for it. That's what you want, isn't it, the glory and the attention? After all, you had no problem taking the credit for the great turnout at the AGM this year.
If it isn't accepted, you can move on and look for else to complain about. Then we can all get back to our lives.
I have never been against a vote. What I have been against all along is the actions you have undertaken in order to get that vote. If you can honestly look in the mirror and tell yourself that the end result justifies the means, no matter who you trample on along the way, then I really, truly feel sorry for you.
It really is a shame that you don't (or can't) harness this power you have and really do some good for the community. It could be pretty amazing.
Still awaiting that apology,
Coach14
Ms. Harding,
Contrary to your accusations, I do not diminish your right to ask questions. I never have. As I said from the very beginning, I believe you should be able to voice your opinion. My objection is that you continually ignore the FACTS that are presented to you, and when you don't get the answer you want, you create issues where there should be no issues. On one hand you state your wishes for a democratic resolution, but on the other hand you censor opposing points of view.
NEVER, EVER have the garbage fees doubled. Your response to the fact that $40 per week X 52 weeks does not equal $1,800, was "In fact, before the flat rate was abandoned, the yearly total was $1800 a year. I know that doesn't seem right but those are the facts. I am not sure why 52 weeks were not paid but they weren't."
I can explain it. It was paid every week. Your statement was the first time, to my recollection, since this issue started that a "flat rate" was EVER mentioned as a method of payment for garbage services. Where did that come from? Can you provide a document that reports an actual figure of $1,800? Show me that, and I will shut my mouth right now, and publicly apologize to you.
The $1,800 was a phantom, fictional budgeted estimate by a new property manager. It was never an actual number. It might as well have come from "Costalotto". Same with the $3,500 figure. (My apologies to other readers for bringing this up over and over, but eventually she has to realize it, doesn't she?) If you can't garner that from looking at a simple income statement, I wouldn't want you anywhere near any business I was involved with.
You claim "he set up his own blog, ostensibly to look at the garbage issue." and that "he seems stuck on this same agenda - we don't have a garbage problem but a Saxon problem".
You and the garbage issue are absolutely intertwined. You don't have one without the other, so by that reasoning it is very much indeed a "Saxon problem". I started this blog, and it is written in plain English, out of frustration with your ignoring of the facts and spinning them to suit your agenda, as well as you forcefeeding your opinon down everyone's throat while not allowing an open forum for debate. My AGENDA, as I have stated all along, is to provide all stakeholders with the opportunity to hear ALL points of view, and make their decision based on all available information, not just limiting it to one point of view and taking that as gospel.You changed it from a garbage problem when you brought in a myriad of other, non-garbage related, JUA issues in an effort to discredit everyone who didn't share your viewpoint, from Larry, the rest of the Board, the Property Manager, Lawyers and now myself.
All I have ever done is point out factual errors in your arguments (which you continually ignore, despite the ironclad nature of them), or offer my own opinion on your suggestions. YOU started the personal attacks, accusations and assumptions. An opinion that differed from yours became "hysterically foaming at the mouth about some point or furiously attacking me".
You have labelled yourself as "person who is pointing out the unwholesome truth."
If it was really the truth you were after, you would have no problem admitting when you are wrong. You would also have no problem listening to other viewpoints even if they differ from your own. Your closed-minded tunnel vision proves otherwise.
Well, ma'am, I have pointed out on numerous occasions elements of your reasonings that you have stated as FACT have been absolutely wrong, most notably your strongest argument. Then you blame others for your mistakes, and proceed to lash out on yet another tangent. I haven't even discussed your bringing the issue to the media yet, in a further effort to discredit Larry Tidman.
Saxon, it really is time to cut your losses, let the garbage committee do their work (if there is still a garbage committee) and wait for your precious vote to take place to gauge the real support for your ideas.
If your idea is accepted, then you can strut around the neighborhood and take credit for it. That's what you want, isn't it, the glory and the attention? After all, you had no problem taking the credit for the great turnout at the AGM this year.
If it isn't accepted, you can move on and look for else to complain about. Then we can all get back to our lives.
I have never been against a vote. What I have been against all along is the actions you have undertaken in order to get that vote. If you can honestly look in the mirror and tell yourself that the end result justifies the means, no matter who you trample on along the way, then I really, truly feel sorry for you.
It really is a shame that you don't (or can't) harness this power you have and really do some good for the community. It could be pretty amazing.
Still awaiting that apology,
Coach14
Assumptions, Assumptions and More Assumptions
To Ms. Harding ( a response to this posting http://costellogarbage.blogspot.com/2009/04/secret-agent-man.html )
Ohhhh, great investigation Saxon.
Who would have ever thought that Coach and Coach14 might be the same person. Duhhhhh! Big stretch there. And besides, I told you that in the first place. All you had to do was ask.
But you making assumptions is what got us all into this mess in the first place.
AT NO POINT WHATSOEVER DID I EVER THREATEN TO "SHOOT" YOU OR IMPLY THAT YOU SHOULD BE SHOT.
I do not roll like that. Your allegations as such are innacurate, plain false and now you are slandering me. By accusing me of threats that I did not make, you are slandering me to people who do know who I am. Show me, or anyone else, where I ever threatened you. I did not make those statements and your assumption that I did is about to get you in a whole heap of trouble.
I want an apology, and not one of your half-assed ones you gave to Larry, or I will be consulting lawyers, because you are way off base and the "game" is over. And if you ever accuse me of such acts again without absolute proof, you will be in court faster than you can say "garbage preparation".
I called it an "alleged" threat because I did not physically see it. I am only going by what you have said, and I know by now that is not a reliable source. If it was actually a threat, I am sorry you recieved it, but I reserve judgement until I have proof...thats the silly thing about me and facts.
I have told you once and I will tell you again....I am NOT on the garbage committee (or the web committee either for that matter as you accused me of)....another assumption that makes you lose even more credibility, if you have any left.
The answer to your question about legal fees - When did I ever investigate, or mention, legal fees? I referred to a lawyer's letter, from 2007 that was mailed out to all 64 owners. I have never even once mentioned Legal Fees or your responsibilty (or lack thereof) for accruing them.
I mentioned you as the pot that called the kettle black because of your continued insisitence to delve into personal lives, while accusing others of doing the same when many would argue that they have the "mandate" to do so when it affects others, despite your opinion to the contrary. It is a matter of opinion. Your "investigations" or demands of peoples personal/business interests is not in any mandate you can justify.
You have been way off base in your assumptions. I did not say a word or ask a question at the AGM. In fact I wasn't even there. I never said I was. And how does my owning a dog or not have any relevance whatsoever to anything?
I did not threaten to "print them all up and dish them out door to door." The only thing I said was that if I didn't have a voice on your blog, "other steps might have to be taken to get the full and complete story out to the concerned stakeholders". The result is this blog.
Once again you accuse me of threatening you by starting my own blog? My god, ma'am, get real.
The difference between you and I is that while I form my opinion from the facts, you spin the facts to fit your opinion.
In the future, I would suggest you have proof, or at least solid evidence, because if you think Larry is gruff and out of line, wait until you put someone's family at risk with your assumptions and/or accusations. You ain't seen nothing yet.
I await your sincere apology and absolute retraction. No talk of "an odd series of coincidences" this time.
Coach14
Ohhhh, great investigation Saxon.
Who would have ever thought that Coach and Coach14 might be the same person. Duhhhhh! Big stretch there. And besides, I told you that in the first place. All you had to do was ask.
But you making assumptions is what got us all into this mess in the first place.
AT NO POINT WHATSOEVER DID I EVER THREATEN TO "SHOOT" YOU OR IMPLY THAT YOU SHOULD BE SHOT.
I do not roll like that. Your allegations as such are innacurate, plain false and now you are slandering me. By accusing me of threats that I did not make, you are slandering me to people who do know who I am. Show me, or anyone else, where I ever threatened you. I did not make those statements and your assumption that I did is about to get you in a whole heap of trouble.
I want an apology, and not one of your half-assed ones you gave to Larry, or I will be consulting lawyers, because you are way off base and the "game" is over. And if you ever accuse me of such acts again without absolute proof, you will be in court faster than you can say "garbage preparation".
I called it an "alleged" threat because I did not physically see it. I am only going by what you have said, and I know by now that is not a reliable source. If it was actually a threat, I am sorry you recieved it, but I reserve judgement until I have proof...thats the silly thing about me and facts.
I have told you once and I will tell you again....I am NOT on the garbage committee (or the web committee either for that matter as you accused me of)....another assumption that makes you lose even more credibility, if you have any left.
The answer to your question about legal fees - When did I ever investigate, or mention, legal fees? I referred to a lawyer's letter, from 2007 that was mailed out to all 64 owners. I have never even once mentioned Legal Fees or your responsibilty (or lack thereof) for accruing them.
I mentioned you as the pot that called the kettle black because of your continued insisitence to delve into personal lives, while accusing others of doing the same when many would argue that they have the "mandate" to do so when it affects others, despite your opinion to the contrary. It is a matter of opinion. Your "investigations" or demands of peoples personal/business interests is not in any mandate you can justify.
You have been way off base in your assumptions. I did not say a word or ask a question at the AGM. In fact I wasn't even there. I never said I was. And how does my owning a dog or not have any relevance whatsoever to anything?
I did not threaten to "print them all up and dish them out door to door." The only thing I said was that if I didn't have a voice on your blog, "other steps might have to be taken to get the full and complete story out to the concerned stakeholders". The result is this blog.
Once again you accuse me of threatening you by starting my own blog? My god, ma'am, get real.
The difference between you and I is that while I form my opinion from the facts, you spin the facts to fit your opinion.
In the future, I would suggest you have proof, or at least solid evidence, because if you think Larry is gruff and out of line, wait until you put someone's family at risk with your assumptions and/or accusations. You ain't seen nothing yet.
I await your sincere apology and absolute retraction. No talk of "an odd series of coincidences" this time.
Coach14
Friday, April 3, 2009
My Error
I was informed that I did indeed make an error.
In my posting about the simple mathematics, I mistakenly used the figure of $60 per week as the fees were going to be increased to. I apologize for my mistake. It made me make an overestimation of the increase and the amounts we pay.
I have been informed that the rate increased last year (around April 1) from $40 per week to $50 per week and that there is no further increase scheduled or asked for by Larry Tidman. The extra pickup rate was also raised from $20 to $25 per pickup at the same time.
So if there were no extra pickups the total anual cost assuming 52 weeks of pickups would be $2600 (plus GST) .
Breakdown Per Home: $40 per year, $3.33 per month, $0.77 per week (this is not the increase but is the total!)
An extra pickup would cost each owner 38 cents.
The increase amounts to 25% over the 8 years, or 3.125% per year.
Thats what this whole quibble is allegedly about...77 cents a week total. An increase to you of 2 cents per day .
In my posting about the simple mathematics, I mistakenly used the figure of $60 per week as the fees were going to be increased to. I apologize for my mistake. It made me make an overestimation of the increase and the amounts we pay.
I have been informed that the rate increased last year (around April 1) from $40 per week to $50 per week and that there is no further increase scheduled or asked for by Larry Tidman. The extra pickup rate was also raised from $20 to $25 per pickup at the same time.
So if there were no extra pickups the total anual cost assuming 52 weeks of pickups would be $2600 (plus GST) .
Breakdown Per Home: $40 per year, $3.33 per month, $0.77 per week (this is not the increase but is the total!)
An extra pickup would cost each owner 38 cents.
The increase amounts to 25% over the 8 years, or 3.125% per year.
Thats what this whole quibble is allegedly about...77 cents a week total. An increase to you of 2 cents per day .
Trash, the whole trash and nothing but the trash!
OK, now that everyone has had a couple of days to air their personal frustrations and fire volleys on both sides, I personally think that it is time to get back to the issue.
Garbage.
Here are the facts:
1. Beginning in 2000, the fees have been $40.00 per week to have the garbage pre-sorted, pads cleaned after the city picked up garbage, as well as daily grounds clean-up, and mainentance of the cans in the parking lots. It started out with 2 men being paid $20 each, but one had to drop out so Larry took over the whole job.
2. When the Regional Group was the property manager, the garbage fees were lumped in with other fees, so there is no way of telling exactly how much was paid in garbage removal alone.
3. When Dixon took over, they mentioned that at it is a fairly common practice at some of their properties for garbage to be prepared beforehand for pickup. (Opinion: makes sense to me, if it is prepared properly by those placing it out, great, if not at least it can be fixed so that there is little or no mess afterwards to be cleaned up.)
4. Larry has asked for a rate increase from what he has been making in the past. (I will confirm the amount, as I have been informed I might have made an error in an earlier post. Once I confirm a couple of numbers I will post a correction if one is necessary. My apologies.)
I interrupt this blog posting because I just went over to check Ms. Harding's blog, and she has continued to branch out to other issues once again. I feel the need to respond in kind. So I will get back to the garbage issue shortly.
1. It appears to me that excessive noise IS indeed covered in the Joint Use Agreement Rules and Regulations.
The incident that is referred to over and over was not a simple noise at 11 or 12. It was 3:15 in the morning. At 11 or 12, perhaps going over and asking to tone it down would be appropriate. So you are saying you would rather have an irate conversation with a person who has been drinking until 3:15 in the morning, asking them to keep it down. In that case, both parties (the one making the noise and the one roused out of their sleep) would be in no shape to have a decent conversation. A letter is a simple way to establish a track record without involving outsiders. Then it informs the person after the fact, that the noise was excessive and please don't let it happen again. It is flabbergasting to me that someone would rather have the police knock on their door than to get a letter informing them that people were disturbed and please don't let it happen again. It is also shocking to me that someone would be so insluted and feel disrespected by a letter, given that the level of disrespect they showed disturbed half of the neighborhood.
Allowing the behaviour to continue without acknowldgement in some way, sets a precedent, and "As we know, once people like this establish a precedent, it can be difficult to retrench. "- as Saxon Harding said here.
2. No neighbor is perfect, and it should not be expected. But rules are rules, no matter how you cut it. You are aware of them and if you think you are above them or choose to ignore them, then you should expect consequences. And who is to enforce them if not the Board or the property manager? If someone builds a shed that floods a neighboring yard every time it rains or snow melts, that is disrespectful and should be dealt with. If you don't feel confident enough to bring the issue up yourself with your neighbour, then it is within your right to ask for help. Larry isn't the only strong personality in the neighborhood, and if a person feels like a vitim of a disrespectful act of that level, that person might also expect to be bullied as well by the offender.
We are in very close proximity to our neighbors and people's actions. whether intentional or not, do affect others. If you want to have a party at 3:15 in the morning, go ahead, that is your right, but you must realize that some people work in the morning no matter what day it is, and their rights are being violated also. Keep it down or keep it inside.
Saxon, you are the kettle that is calling the pot black. You have done more meddling into people's personal and business affairs more than anyone, and been doing it in such a way that is misleading and downright wrong in many cases, as has been proven with FACTS. You spin half-truths to your own benefit and to gain sympathy, just like when you claimed a former board member resigned because he didn't like the way you were treated. WRONG...in fact he did call you to apologize for the way he spoke to you at the AGM, but he resigned because he didn't have the time nor the energy to put up with you and your BS crusade again.
Now back to the garbage. Thank you for allowing me to rant.
4. (continued) The extra pickups are rare and the fact is that on long weekends, people go away and need to put it out Thursday, or Friday morning wake up and realize it is Friday, and just put the garbage out without thinking that it . (OPINION: It happens, I have done it myself, and I know I am not the only one. It will also continue to, no matter how many reminders are sent out.) Then animals and wind happen and an extra sweep is needed, for example, when incidents such as the skunk that was ripping into bags just this morning, happen.
5. Larry hasn't billed the association for any dump runs he has had to make for the associations' garbage, since he has been able to mix it with refuse from his job-sites, thus SAVING THE ASSOCIATION MONEY. Approximately $20 per trip minimum, depending on the materials involved. (OPINION: Thank-you Larry. Who would be willing to store the left-overs until one of Saxon's "dump runs"?)
6. It has been openly disclosed that PT Robertson & Associates is a company owned by Larry Tidman, and that he is a board member. That disclosure, in the minds of Lawyers and Auditors, is enough to satisfy any "conflict of interest" allegations or concerns.
7. There was a garbage committee struck at the AGM, to address Saxon Harding's issues. They have not been active in the process of gathering information or making recommendations. (OPINION: At least I haven't hear a peep. I know they may be busy with living their lives, which is well within their right. But the issue is at a head and they are nowhere to be seen and it has been a month and a half.)
Garbage.
Here are the facts:
1. Beginning in 2000, the fees have been $40.00 per week to have the garbage pre-sorted, pads cleaned after the city picked up garbage, as well as daily grounds clean-up, and mainentance of the cans in the parking lots. It started out with 2 men being paid $20 each, but one had to drop out so Larry took over the whole job.
2. When the Regional Group was the property manager, the garbage fees were lumped in with other fees, so there is no way of telling exactly how much was paid in garbage removal alone.
3. When Dixon took over, they mentioned that at it is a fairly common practice at some of their properties for garbage to be prepared beforehand for pickup. (Opinion: makes sense to me, if it is prepared properly by those placing it out, great, if not at least it can be fixed so that there is little or no mess afterwards to be cleaned up.)
4. Larry has asked for a rate increase from what he has been making in the past. (I will confirm the amount, as I have been informed I might have made an error in an earlier post. Once I confirm a couple of numbers I will post a correction if one is necessary. My apologies.)
I interrupt this blog posting because I just went over to check Ms. Harding's blog, and she has continued to branch out to other issues once again. I feel the need to respond in kind. So I will get back to the garbage issue shortly.
1. It appears to me that excessive noise IS indeed covered in the Joint Use Agreement Rules and Regulations.
The incident that is referred to over and over was not a simple noise at 11 or 12. It was 3:15 in the morning. At 11 or 12, perhaps going over and asking to tone it down would be appropriate. So you are saying you would rather have an irate conversation with a person who has been drinking until 3:15 in the morning, asking them to keep it down. In that case, both parties (the one making the noise and the one roused out of their sleep) would be in no shape to have a decent conversation. A letter is a simple way to establish a track record without involving outsiders. Then it informs the person after the fact, that the noise was excessive and please don't let it happen again. It is flabbergasting to me that someone would rather have the police knock on their door than to get a letter informing them that people were disturbed and please don't let it happen again. It is also shocking to me that someone would be so insluted and feel disrespected by a letter, given that the level of disrespect they showed disturbed half of the neighborhood.
Allowing the behaviour to continue without acknowldgement in some way, sets a precedent, and "As we know, once people like this establish a precedent, it can be difficult to retrench. "- as Saxon Harding said here.
2. No neighbor is perfect, and it should not be expected. But rules are rules, no matter how you cut it. You are aware of them and if you think you are above them or choose to ignore them, then you should expect consequences. And who is to enforce them if not the Board or the property manager? If someone builds a shed that floods a neighboring yard every time it rains or snow melts, that is disrespectful and should be dealt with. If you don't feel confident enough to bring the issue up yourself with your neighbour, then it is within your right to ask for help. Larry isn't the only strong personality in the neighborhood, and if a person feels like a vitim of a disrespectful act of that level, that person might also expect to be bullied as well by the offender.
We are in very close proximity to our neighbors and people's actions. whether intentional or not, do affect others. If you want to have a party at 3:15 in the morning, go ahead, that is your right, but you must realize that some people work in the morning no matter what day it is, and their rights are being violated also. Keep it down or keep it inside.
Saxon, you are the kettle that is calling the pot black. You have done more meddling into people's personal and business affairs more than anyone, and been doing it in such a way that is misleading and downright wrong in many cases, as has been proven with FACTS. You spin half-truths to your own benefit and to gain sympathy, just like when you claimed a former board member resigned because he didn't like the way you were treated. WRONG...in fact he did call you to apologize for the way he spoke to you at the AGM, but he resigned because he didn't have the time nor the energy to put up with you and your BS crusade again.
Now back to the garbage. Thank you for allowing me to rant.
4. (continued) The extra pickups are rare and the fact is that on long weekends, people go away and need to put it out Thursday, or Friday morning wake up and realize it is Friday, and just put the garbage out without thinking that it . (OPINION: It happens, I have done it myself, and I know I am not the only one. It will also continue to, no matter how many reminders are sent out.) Then animals and wind happen and an extra sweep is needed, for example, when incidents such as the skunk that was ripping into bags just this morning, happen.
5. Larry hasn't billed the association for any dump runs he has had to make for the associations' garbage, since he has been able to mix it with refuse from his job-sites, thus SAVING THE ASSOCIATION MONEY. Approximately $20 per trip minimum, depending on the materials involved. (OPINION: Thank-you Larry. Who would be willing to store the left-overs until one of Saxon's "dump runs"?)
6. It has been openly disclosed that PT Robertson & Associates is a company owned by Larry Tidman, and that he is a board member. That disclosure, in the minds of Lawyers and Auditors, is enough to satisfy any "conflict of interest" allegations or concerns.
7. There was a garbage committee struck at the AGM, to address Saxon Harding's issues. They have not been active in the process of gathering information or making recommendations. (OPINION: At least I haven't hear a peep. I know they may be busy with living their lives, which is well within their right. But the issue is at a head and they are nowhere to be seen and it has been a month and a half.)
Thursday, April 2, 2009
Referendum?
Now Saxon Harding wants a referendum, a democratic way to solve the issue to avoid "creating a backlash against the board". This coming from the person who will not post peoples comments unless she thinks "it adds something to the issue". Even then she reserves the right to edit it and paraphrase "Like any publisher, I have the right to edit your comments - it is my blog, after all." she claims. Well last time I checked, editors of newspapers do NOT edit letters to the editor for example, which is exactly what responses to a blog are, in my opinion. They are free to respond, and sometimes do, but the letters are printed as they are written.
Anyways, back to the referendum. So far most of the comments on this blog have demonstrated that people just see it as a non-issue. A couple of people have complained about the cost, but aside from that, people seem happy with the service, and acknowledge that there is a marked difference since it ended. So the "backlash" is basically coming from one voice who wants to claim to speak for the majority, and it has already happened. Twice. And the last time two years ago, it was rebuffed, allegations considered, and denied. Why will this time be any different?
Lets examine Ms. Harding's major beefs:
1. The costs have almost doubled in the last 2 years.
False - It has been proven that her "facts" were mistaken, and the numbers are more like a 50% increase in 10 years.
2. There is a conflict of interest on the board.
You can have your own opinion on this one but the facts are that both the board's lawyers and the auditor have found that as long as it is openly reported that the owner of the company who provides the service is a board member, there is no conflict of interest.
3. There is the same amount of garbage as there was, so why the rate increase?
I don't know for sure, but I would counter with the argument that there seems to be a lot of children now in the neighborhood that are under the age of 10. Also some that have recently moved in. More people equals more garbage. I don't know what the tally of people was in 2000, but I would bet dollars to donuts that there are at least 10% more people living in Costello Gardens. Same number of households, yes. Same number of people, not likely. Same amount of garbage, hardly.
Put aside cost of living and inflation , I think the rate increase is justified based on that fact alone.
Also, it is my personal belief based on her comments, that it isn't really the fact that the money is being spent (it is less than 5% of the association fees that goes to garbage), her problem is where it is going, and that is a personal issue for her, and she felt the need to lash out. That is just my opinion.
Very Sad
Anyways, back to the referendum. So far most of the comments on this blog have demonstrated that people just see it as a non-issue. A couple of people have complained about the cost, but aside from that, people seem happy with the service, and acknowledge that there is a marked difference since it ended. So the "backlash" is basically coming from one voice who wants to claim to speak for the majority, and it has already happened. Twice. And the last time two years ago, it was rebuffed, allegations considered, and denied. Why will this time be any different?
Lets examine Ms. Harding's major beefs:
1. The costs have almost doubled in the last 2 years.
False - It has been proven that her "facts" were mistaken, and the numbers are more like a 50% increase in 10 years.
2. There is a conflict of interest on the board.
You can have your own opinion on this one but the facts are that both the board's lawyers and the auditor have found that as long as it is openly reported that the owner of the company who provides the service is a board member, there is no conflict of interest.
3. There is the same amount of garbage as there was, so why the rate increase?
I don't know for sure, but I would counter with the argument that there seems to be a lot of children now in the neighborhood that are under the age of 10. Also some that have recently moved in. More people equals more garbage. I don't know what the tally of people was in 2000, but I would bet dollars to donuts that there are at least 10% more people living in Costello Gardens. Same number of households, yes. Same number of people, not likely. Same amount of garbage, hardly.
Put aside cost of living and inflation , I think the rate increase is justified based on that fact alone.
Also, it is my personal belief based on her comments, that it isn't really the fact that the money is being spent (it is less than 5% of the association fees that goes to garbage), her problem is where it is going, and that is a personal issue for her, and she felt the need to lash out. That is just my opinion.
Very Sad
Wednesday, April 1, 2009
R-E-S-P-E-C-T
Another question that was asked in the comments was "have you been on the receiving end of one of the “President’s” so called “rants”?"
The answer to the question in a nutshell is "no, I haven't". I feel that I have been respectful of my neighbors, and in turn that respect has been shown back to me. Any beefs anyone has with the President, that I have heard about so far, have been from lack of respect for a fellow owner or owners or broken rules that have affected other owners or the community. You might not like the way it is handled, but if you don't want to be told, then just be respectful of your fellow neighbors. I'm not saying those people are disrespectful as a whole, but they have done disrespectful things.
Yes, I admit Larry can be gruff at times. Who isn't? However, it is not his job to hold your hand and coddle you with kid gloves. Someone posted "we are homeowners, not children or employees". My point exactly. In many of these cases, the offender should know better. Sometimes common sense needs to come into play. It all comes down to respect. All of these cases I have heard about and that have been rehashed over and over, stem from a lack of respect. Instead of learning from the mistake and working to correct it, those people are too thin-skinned and take it personally, or too stubborn to realize they are indeed at fault. I'm not saying Larry is a Saint, he simply tells it like it is. You break a rule, fix it, apologize if necessary and try to make sure it doesn't happen again.
Look at the position he holds. As was posted in the comments to an earlier posting, he is the volunteer President of the Association, and rightly or wrongly he is the first person people call on when there is an issue between owners. He can either deal with it himself and explain the rules, or have Dixon deal with it. Then, of course, people complain when they get a letter from Dixon.
He is in a no-win, damned if you do, damned if you don't situation, and I echo those comments posted earlier that wonder why he has put up with the BS for so long already. He certainly does not deserve to be personally and very publicly attacked by falsehoods and mis-truths or to have his personal business dragged through the mud where it is of no concern to anyone but him.
Its not like this is breaking news. He has been around long enough, that people have had ample opportunity to have someone run against him to get him removed if you have such a problem with him personally. So either no one else wants the job, or there must be enough people out there who respect the job he does to keep him in the position.
The answer to the question in a nutshell is "no, I haven't". I feel that I have been respectful of my neighbors, and in turn that respect has been shown back to me. Any beefs anyone has with the President, that I have heard about so far, have been from lack of respect for a fellow owner or owners or broken rules that have affected other owners or the community. You might not like the way it is handled, but if you don't want to be told, then just be respectful of your fellow neighbors. I'm not saying those people are disrespectful as a whole, but they have done disrespectful things.
Yes, I admit Larry can be gruff at times. Who isn't? However, it is not his job to hold your hand and coddle you with kid gloves. Someone posted "we are homeowners, not children or employees". My point exactly. In many of these cases, the offender should know better. Sometimes common sense needs to come into play. It all comes down to respect. All of these cases I have heard about and that have been rehashed over and over, stem from a lack of respect. Instead of learning from the mistake and working to correct it, those people are too thin-skinned and take it personally, or too stubborn to realize they are indeed at fault. I'm not saying Larry is a Saint, he simply tells it like it is. You break a rule, fix it, apologize if necessary and try to make sure it doesn't happen again.
Look at the position he holds. As was posted in the comments to an earlier posting, he is the volunteer President of the Association, and rightly or wrongly he is the first person people call on when there is an issue between owners. He can either deal with it himself and explain the rules, or have Dixon deal with it. Then, of course, people complain when they get a letter from Dixon.
He is in a no-win, damned if you do, damned if you don't situation, and I echo those comments posted earlier that wonder why he has put up with the BS for so long already. He certainly does not deserve to be personally and very publicly attacked by falsehoods and mis-truths or to have his personal business dragged through the mud where it is of no concern to anyone but him.
Its not like this is breaking news. He has been around long enough, that people have had ample opportunity to have someone run against him to get him removed if you have such a problem with him personally. So either no one else wants the job, or there must be enough people out there who respect the job he does to keep him in the position.
Q & A
A sincere Thank-you to all who have taken the time to read the postings, and to those who have chosen to comment on them as well. Whether you agree or disagree with my point of view, the discussion and points that have been raised have been enlightening. I am but one voice, no more important than any one of you, so if I can post my point of view, you should have the same right.
I want to answer a question that has been left on the comments. The question being, why am I posting anonymously? I am not revealing my identity for a wide variety of reasons that don't involve this blog, but also, because I am not in it for any recognition. Nor do I want any backlash once the issue is finally over. I am sure there are some of you who do not agree with my points and share Saxon Harding's point of view, and that is fine.
I don't feel that making my identity public would change my opinion or the facts that I present. There would be very little to gain, with a lot of headaches, by revealing who I am. So I will continue to post anonymously, and allow you to do the same.
It has worked well so far, in my opinion.
I want to answer a question that has been left on the comments. The question being, why am I posting anonymously? I am not revealing my identity for a wide variety of reasons that don't involve this blog, but also, because I am not in it for any recognition. Nor do I want any backlash once the issue is finally over. I am sure there are some of you who do not agree with my points and share Saxon Harding's point of view, and that is fine.
I don't feel that making my identity public would change my opinion or the facts that I present. There would be very little to gain, with a lot of headaches, by revealing who I am. So I will continue to post anonymously, and allow you to do the same.
It has worked well so far, in my opinion.
Friday, March 27, 2009
The "other" blog, its effect & a response from me
As I said in my Welcome post, this blog was started in response to another blog, started by Saxon Harding. As you know, she then took it upon herself to put slips of paper in every owner's mailbox advertising it.
I read and kept up to date with it for a while, and while the garbage related comments were concerned, I didn't necessarily agree, but opinions are like belly buttons, everyone has one and some are "innies" and some are "outies".
What drew my attention and my ire was when she started personal attacks against an individual, who was the President of the homeowners association. These attacks were unwarranted and continued, well beyond the scope of the garbage issue. Some of these posts were untrue, some were completely irrelevant to her concerns and quite frankly none of her business, just as it isn't yours or mine.
She also strayed away from the base issue of garbage preparation and brought up any and all complaints, whether real or manufactured to, in my opinion, slander the president in an attempt to advance her agenda.
It was then that I felt the need to weigh in with my own opinions and began responding to her posts, since after all she asked for feedback. Much to my chagrin, instead of engaging in an open dialogue, she picked which responses to publish, which were the ones that she could argue back. The ones that she had no argument for went unacknowledged.
She then allegedly felt threatened by a response to a blog, and shut the blog down.
After a week or so, she started back up all over again, adding the property manager to her vendetta (apparently it is a massive conspiracy), which you can now read at your leisure at http://costellogarbage.blogspot.com/.
What follows is my response to Ms. Harding's post about my comments where she chose to disect my response (hey at least she printed that one!) intersperse it with her own comments. (The blog was titled "A Leadership Role for Larry". I would have responded to her directly but what is the point? She wants to argue via the internet, I can do the same.
An Open Letter to Ms Harding:
So, you welcome comments and are ready to publish the ones that AGREE with your points, but shun those comments that do not. Once again, not very democratic.
You mentioned that you started your blog to make sure your opinion and the opinion of owners opposed to the garbage system could be heard.
You put notice in all owners' mailboxes (except one I assume) and solicited feedback. I find it quite astonishing that you thought you could post whatever you wanted on your blog about others in the neighborhood that are at times untrue and borderline defamation and slander, and not draw criticism for doing so!
You mention that you require people to be civil and respectful and claimed that I was not. Show me where anything I have said to you is any worse than what you had written on your blog about others. You find my remarks insulting and arrogant when all I did was argue with you about your points, disagree with your methods and in one instance point out a mathematical error that a 14 year old high school student would be able to figure out. It just so happened that pointing the error out destroyed one of your main issues of discontent. Do not preach civility to me, as it is clearly something you do not practice.
In another post you referred to "Power Trippers". What would you call your picking and choosing and editorializing? I wanted an open debate, but you, ma'am, shrugged me off with a statement "If I don't think it adds anything to the issues, I'll leave it out". I ask you, who is the one on the power trip?
In fact, I can't understand why the blog came up at all, since at the AGM a garbage committee was struck that was to address the issues you had brought up. That should have been the end of it. But the personal, petty attacks persisted and expanded to include thinly veiled shots at not just the President but all board members as well as property managers, with your "parallel universe" analogy. (A post I will address that post at another time).
It has me questioning exactly what your agenda is, and wondering how far you will go to execute it. It is clearly not a garbage issue any longer, and that is a result of your blog. So don't complain when it comes back at you with equal vigor.
I read and kept up to date with it for a while, and while the garbage related comments were concerned, I didn't necessarily agree, but opinions are like belly buttons, everyone has one and some are "innies" and some are "outies".
What drew my attention and my ire was when she started personal attacks against an individual, who was the President of the homeowners association. These attacks were unwarranted and continued, well beyond the scope of the garbage issue. Some of these posts were untrue, some were completely irrelevant to her concerns and quite frankly none of her business, just as it isn't yours or mine.
She also strayed away from the base issue of garbage preparation and brought up any and all complaints, whether real or manufactured to, in my opinion, slander the president in an attempt to advance her agenda.
It was then that I felt the need to weigh in with my own opinions and began responding to her posts, since after all she asked for feedback. Much to my chagrin, instead of engaging in an open dialogue, she picked which responses to publish, which were the ones that she could argue back. The ones that she had no argument for went unacknowledged.
She then allegedly felt threatened by a response to a blog, and shut the blog down.
After a week or so, she started back up all over again, adding the property manager to her vendetta (apparently it is a massive conspiracy), which you can now read at your leisure at http://costellogarbage.blogspot.com/.
What follows is my response to Ms. Harding's post about my comments where she chose to disect my response (hey at least she printed that one!) intersperse it with her own comments. (The blog was titled "A Leadership Role for Larry". I would have responded to her directly but what is the point? She wants to argue via the internet, I can do the same.
An Open Letter to Ms Harding:
So, you welcome comments and are ready to publish the ones that AGREE with your points, but shun those comments that do not. Once again, not very democratic.
You mentioned that you started your blog to make sure your opinion and the opinion of owners opposed to the garbage system could be heard.
You put notice in all owners' mailboxes (except one I assume) and solicited feedback. I find it quite astonishing that you thought you could post whatever you wanted on your blog about others in the neighborhood that are at times untrue and borderline defamation and slander, and not draw criticism for doing so!
You mention that you require people to be civil and respectful and claimed that I was not. Show me where anything I have said to you is any worse than what you had written on your blog about others. You find my remarks insulting and arrogant when all I did was argue with you about your points, disagree with your methods and in one instance point out a mathematical error that a 14 year old high school student would be able to figure out. It just so happened that pointing the error out destroyed one of your main issues of discontent. Do not preach civility to me, as it is clearly something you do not practice.
In another post you referred to "Power Trippers". What would you call your picking and choosing and editorializing? I wanted an open debate, but you, ma'am, shrugged me off with a statement "If I don't think it adds anything to the issues, I'll leave it out". I ask you, who is the one on the power trip?
In fact, I can't understand why the blog came up at all, since at the AGM a garbage committee was struck that was to address the issues you had brought up. That should have been the end of it. But the personal, petty attacks persisted and expanded to include thinly veiled shots at not just the President but all board members as well as property managers, with your "parallel universe" analogy. (A post I will address that post at another time).
It has me questioning exactly what your agenda is, and wondering how far you will go to execute it. It is clearly not a garbage issue any longer, and that is a result of your blog. So don't complain when it comes back at you with equal vigor.
Thursday, March 26, 2009
Simple Mathematics & Rate Increases
This post deals with facts and figures so might be a little mundane but please bear with me...
By her own admission, Ms Harding states that when the garbage system preparation first started, two men were paid $20 (each) per week to clean the pads. That is a total of $40 per week. Multiply that by 52 weeks and that is a total of $2,080. This was in the year 2000.
Fast forward to 2009/2010, and the budgeted amount approved by the board is $60 per week ($3,120) plus a contingency for extra pickups that are required, for a total of $3,500 budgeted.
By her own admission, Ms Harding states that when the garbage system preparation first started, two men were paid $20 (each) per week to clean the pads. That is a total of $40 per week. Multiply that by 52 weeks and that is a total of $2,080. This was in the year 2000.
Fast forward to 2009/2010, and the budgeted amount approved by the board is $60 per week ($3,120) plus a contingency for extra pickups that are required, for a total of $3,500 budgeted.
Lets see....double the $2,080 and that would equal....hmmm....$4,160? That is a far cry from the $3,500 that is budgeted, and nowhere near double the amount paid in 2007 or 2008 (which the audited amounts were $2,746.00 and $2,709 respectively) or 2009 (unaudited).
If you use the $3,120 figure being the anticipated cost, that is an increase of 50% over 11 years, (or 4.55% per year on average).
Now put that aside for a moment while I throw a few facts and figures at you.
From the year 2000 to the year 2009 the following changes have taken place in the world:
*Minimum wage in Ontario has gone from $6.85 /hr to the current $9.50/hr (as of March 31st, 2009) - % INCREASE = 38.6%
*The consumer price index (CPI) for the 9 year period - INCREASE of 20.94%
*The average inflation rate over the period is 2.13%/year
* The average price of gas in Canada in 2000 was 71.5 cents per litre, in 2007 it was $1.01.8. - % INCREASE = 42.4%
So as you can see, costs for many items increase over time, not just for Costello Gardens garbage service.
And even other costs did not increase over time, the last time I checked we were in a free market economy, where service providers were free to charge what they want for their services, and if they want to increase the cost of the service, they have that option. If the increase is approved by those who receive the service, then the relationship continues. If not, then the relationship ends. Simple as that.
I know that the response to this statement will include the words "conflict of interest" and that issue will be addressed in a later posting.
This post is just an explanation of why the rates increase, and also proving once again the falsehood of Ms Harding's claims that the fees have almost doubled in the last two years.
Who else would step to the plate?
Ms Harding's biggest complaint in the beginning was the escalating fees for the service provided. She claims that the budget for the garbage preparation service has more than doubled in the past two years. (More on this claim in another posting to come later).
Perhaps she and her silent "supporters" should stop and think that maybe they were getting a bargain before, and that the current approved amount is more in line with what other people would charge for the service. We live in a free market economy, and service providers are free to charge what they want for the service.
One of Ms Harding's solutions is to find someone else to do it. Maybe we can find someone to volunteer to do it for free or a lot less. At any point I am sure the board would listen to proposals if it meant saving money. They don't have to go out and solicit offers, if someone wanted to do it for less all they would have to do is step up and offer. But I don't see anyone stepping to the plate to do that.
Lets face it, people have better things to do (jobs, family, etc.) than to worry about the garbage issue. As for the value, I think the service provided is well worth the $1 or so a week it costs me, regardless of what it did cost in the past. And I also don't care if it goes to Joe Blow down the street, the President of the Association, the President of the PTA or the President of the USA.
Perhaps she and her silent "supporters" should stop and think that maybe they were getting a bargain before, and that the current approved amount is more in line with what other people would charge for the service. We live in a free market economy, and service providers are free to charge what they want for the service.
One of Ms Harding's solutions is to find someone else to do it. Maybe we can find someone to volunteer to do it for free or a lot less. At any point I am sure the board would listen to proposals if it meant saving money. They don't have to go out and solicit offers, if someone wanted to do it for less all they would have to do is step up and offer. But I don't see anyone stepping to the plate to do that.
Lets face it, people have better things to do (jobs, family, etc.) than to worry about the garbage issue. As for the value, I think the service provided is well worth the $1 or so a week it costs me, regardless of what it did cost in the past. And I also don't care if it goes to Joe Blow down the street, the President of the Association, the President of the PTA or the President of the USA.
Required Service or "Cadillac Service"
Much of Ms Harding's argument stems from the fact that she asserts that the service is not required. She questions why we need to prepare garbage before pickup, and why not just clean it up after. She also wants surveys, email reminders, telephone calls and the like to remind owners when to put it out, what to put out and what is not acceptable to put out to be picked up.
She also suggested that people could "sign up" for these reminders. I would argue that people don't want to be bothered with that kind of nagging, friendly or not. Everyone receives a calender every year from the City with the dates on it, and what recycling day it is. The people who sign up for such services as Ms Harding proposes are not the ones who need it. People just want to get the garbage out, either Thursday night or Friday morning, and be done with it. Some people package it properly, others do not. Some put it out when they are supposed to, others are late. Some are a week early and don't put it out properly (as with the bed-frame and bookshelves that were put out Sunday this past week on one garbage pad). There has also been a bag (I can only assume containing dog poop) sitting on the patio stone where a garbage bin once stood, for at least 2 days (this being Wednesday). Whether we like it or not, people walk their animals through Costello Gardens who are not residents and they don't care about what happens. All I know for sure is that the bag would be in a garbage bin right now as opposed to sitting on the ground where animals (or children for that matter) can get into.
In the end, I personally don't care what other Associations do. I have driven down Monterey Dr. on a Saturday morning and seen firsthand the various messes that are left behind in many instances. Not always, but on many occasions. I also know darn well that a similar mess would sure as heck not have been found on Costello Gardens garbage pads in the past. Lo and behold, the first week of the hiatus from preparation, there were empty containers left behind on at least 2 of the 4 pads, and they remained there for more than a couple of days.
I was not living here before the preparation system was started and therefore I cannot attest to how it was, all I know is that since we have moved in to the neighborhood 2 years ago, the grounds have been mostly litter-free, and the garbage pads have been very clean. It was one of the things that attracted us to Costello Gardens in the first place.
She also suggested that people could "sign up" for these reminders. I would argue that people don't want to be bothered with that kind of nagging, friendly or not. Everyone receives a calender every year from the City with the dates on it, and what recycling day it is. The people who sign up for such services as Ms Harding proposes are not the ones who need it. People just want to get the garbage out, either Thursday night or Friday morning, and be done with it. Some people package it properly, others do not. Some put it out when they are supposed to, others are late. Some are a week early and don't put it out properly (as with the bed-frame and bookshelves that were put out Sunday this past week on one garbage pad). There has also been a bag (I can only assume containing dog poop) sitting on the patio stone where a garbage bin once stood, for at least 2 days (this being Wednesday). Whether we like it or not, people walk their animals through Costello Gardens who are not residents and they don't care about what happens. All I know for sure is that the bag would be in a garbage bin right now as opposed to sitting on the ground where animals (or children for that matter) can get into.
In the end, I personally don't care what other Associations do. I have driven down Monterey Dr. on a Saturday morning and seen firsthand the various messes that are left behind in many instances. Not always, but on many occasions. I also know darn well that a similar mess would sure as heck not have been found on Costello Gardens garbage pads in the past. Lo and behold, the first week of the hiatus from preparation, there were empty containers left behind on at least 2 of the 4 pads, and they remained there for more than a couple of days.
I was not living here before the preparation system was started and therefore I cannot attest to how it was, all I know is that since we have moved in to the neighborhood 2 years ago, the grounds have been mostly litter-free, and the garbage pads have been very clean. It was one of the things that attracted us to Costello Gardens in the first place.
Democracy
I agree with Ms Harding that the garbage issue should be solved democratically, however I disagree with her apparent views on what a democracy is.
First of all, I believe in freedom of speech, which is why I will post any comments about the issue I receive, whether they agree with my point of view or not. That is the ONLY way the issue can be solved. Let the stakeholders make an informed opinion by listening to all points of view, and don't force-feed one side of the story while ignoring other valid points if they do not promote or advance a certain agenda.
Secondly, the Board has been elected to make the decisions. Not every decision the board makes will satisfy all owners, but they have every right to make the decision, and they have the authority to do so. Owners should absolutely have a voice and be able to air their opinions, but in the end it is the board members who decide what is in the best interest of the Association as a whole.
I know some of the Board members personally and I would not expect anything to sway their opinion from what is best for the community.
First of all, I believe in freedom of speech, which is why I will post any comments about the issue I receive, whether they agree with my point of view or not. That is the ONLY way the issue can be solved. Let the stakeholders make an informed opinion by listening to all points of view, and don't force-feed one side of the story while ignoring other valid points if they do not promote or advance a certain agenda.
Secondly, the Board has been elected to make the decisions. Not every decision the board makes will satisfy all owners, but they have every right to make the decision, and they have the authority to do so. Owners should absolutely have a voice and be able to air their opinions, but in the end it is the board members who decide what is in the best interest of the Association as a whole.
I know some of the Board members personally and I would not expect anything to sway their opinion from what is best for the community.
What is the Real Issue?
For those of you who are new to the issue, or just haven't been following along over the last couple of months, a concerned resident started blogging on the Costello Garbage issue, and that blog can be found at http://costellogarbage.blogspot.com/. I urge you to read up on that if you haven't already, because a lot of what I will be discussion arises from that site.
Truth be told, the issue began as a garbage issue, with the blogger voicing an opinion. I have no problem with that, she just wanted to be heard.
The issue I have with her postings began with personal attacks upon another individual and accusations that she made against him that were classless, baseless and had nothing whatsoever to do with the issue of garbage removal at Costello Gardens. She brought up other issues that had no bearing on the garbage issue to try to further what I feel is a personal vendetta against an individual.
Unfortunately, the blogger discontinued blogging and removed all posts for a short period of time, before re-appearing with a new blog, under the same name. She left the original postings off the site, so a lot of the issues are not readable right now if you have not been following along since about early February.
Truth be told, the issue began as a garbage issue, with the blogger voicing an opinion. I have no problem with that, she just wanted to be heard.
The issue I have with her postings began with personal attacks upon another individual and accusations that she made against him that were classless, baseless and had nothing whatsoever to do with the issue of garbage removal at Costello Gardens. She brought up other issues that had no bearing on the garbage issue to try to further what I feel is a personal vendetta against an individual.
Unfortunately, the blogger discontinued blogging and removed all posts for a short period of time, before re-appearing with a new blog, under the same name. She left the original postings off the site, so a lot of the issues are not readable right now if you have not been following along since about early February.
Welcome!
Hello, and welcome to the new blog site that will examine the issue of garbage at Costello Gardens.
I started this blog out of frustration at my voice not being heard on another resident's blog, and the inability to get the individual to acknowledge opinions different from their own. I was also increasingly frustrated with half-truths, spinning of facts and outright lies coming from that blog.
I have a lot to say, and I will get to that over the next couple of days.
Unlike the other blog, I welcome an open dialogue, and any comments received will be published as written, not paraphrased by me in another blog posting. Feel free to comment anonymously if you do not want your identity revealed.
My blog postings will be my opinion only, and are not necessarily those of anyone else. Any comments received will not be my opinion, but those of the sender. Whether you agree or not with my opinion doesn't matter, I only want both sides of the issue revealed in an open dialogue so that the stakeholders can make an informed decision.
That being said, I will get to the heart of the matter and try not to be too long winded.
I started this blog out of frustration at my voice not being heard on another resident's blog, and the inability to get the individual to acknowledge opinions different from their own. I was also increasingly frustrated with half-truths, spinning of facts and outright lies coming from that blog.
I have a lot to say, and I will get to that over the next couple of days.
Unlike the other blog, I welcome an open dialogue, and any comments received will be published as written, not paraphrased by me in another blog posting. Feel free to comment anonymously if you do not want your identity revealed.
My blog postings will be my opinion only, and are not necessarily those of anyone else. Any comments received will not be my opinion, but those of the sender. Whether you agree or not with my opinion doesn't matter, I only want both sides of the issue revealed in an open dialogue so that the stakeholders can make an informed decision.
That being said, I will get to the heart of the matter and try not to be too long winded.
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